Does YouTube Help You Show Up in AI Search?

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Ryan Doser has been working in SEO for roughly a decade. But as search behavior has expanded beyond Google into ChatGPT, YouTube, TikTok, Reddit, and other platforms, he's started thinking about SEO differently: not just search engine optimization, but "search everywhere optimization."

In this episode, Ryan and I talk about why long-form video can do much more than build a YouTube audience. It can give search engines and AI systems another surface for understanding who you are, what you know, and what your brand should be associated with. We also get into the growing importance of third-party trust signals, where traditional SEO still fits into AI search, and some of the GEO advice Ryan thinks marketers should be questioning.

In this episode:

• Why Ryan thinks marketers should shift from "search engine optimization" to "search everywhere optimization"
• Why trust signals and third-party surfaces matter more as brands try to build visibility beyond traditional Google search
• Why Ryan has "never been more bullish" on YouTube as an AI search marketer
• How YouTube can become the foundation for blog posts, newsletters, short-form video, and other content
• Where to start if your brand wants to build a YouTube presence, from defining your ICP to finding the topics they're actually searching for
• Why Ryan recommends at least one long-form YouTube video a week — and why he favors evergreen content over constantly chasing trends
• The relationship between traditional SEO and AI search optimization, and why Ryan pushes back hard on claims that SEO is dead
• Where llms.txt fits into Ryan's strategy — and why he considers it a small piece of a much bigger visibility puzzle
• Why podcast appearances, media coverage, speaking, video, and other off-site signals can help establish what a person or brand is known for
• Why starting your own podcast or another form of long-form content can create a foundation for visibility across multiple platforms

I'm an AI search visibility consultant and a fractional content strategist for startups and enterprise brands. If that sounds like the kind of help you're looking for, email me at cassie@cassieclarkmarketing.com. 

Or request your AI Search Visibility Audit: https://cassieclarkmarketing.com/ai-search-visibility-audit/

Transcript

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SPEAKER_00 0:34

Yeah, okay. Tell us who you are. You do all the things.

SPEAKER_01 0:37

Yeah, so I'm Ryan Dozer, AI marketer and YouTuber. I run a six-figure marketing agency, and then I also have a YouTube channel with over 39,000 subscribers now. I also run an AI marketing community with over 1,700 members. Um, really have dove into the weeds of AI search, which is something that we're going to talk about today. So this is very good timing.

SPEAKER_00 0:57

So I always like to ask when someone is on, how long have you been deep in the weeds on AI search optimization? Because I mean it's still new, but also old enough that some of us have been in it for a hot minute.

SPEAKER_01 1:10

I've been in the SEO space, I think, since 2016, right around there. So right around like the BERT updates, right? You know, that sort of era. So I've been in the SEO space for 10 years. AI search, you know, I would even argue to someone that you'd have featured snippets, right? And all these other SERP elements, you could argue that that was even AI search back in the day, right? Because we're taking clicks away from the traditional 10 blue links and then having, you know, a different SERP feature, pushing one blog. Yes, it drove traffic, but it still added another feature like a featured snippet. Fast forward to like ChatGPT 2022, 2023-ish, somewhere around there. That's when you had no other option but to go into AI search, right? Because the eyeballs and the traffic moved from ChatGPT, Claude, Perplexity, Grok, um, you know, other platforms now, right? And I also changed the narrative of SEO as search engine optimization to search everywhere optimization. That's kind of my new framework behind this now. Whether it's YouTube, Google, Bing, TikTok, Pinterest, X, all of these platforms have a search functionality. So marketers really need to be thinking about search everywhere optimization and not associating just SEO with traditional Google search like we have for the past 10, 15 years.

SPEAKER_00 2:25

Yeah. And another thing, Reddit too, is now also kind of like a search platform because they have that AI feature, you type in what you're looking for, and then it gives you all the things. That's helpful, I think. I fall into Reddit rabbit holes all the time. All the time. So when you're thinking about AI search optimization, what's like something different that you've noticed about it compared to just traditional SEO?

SPEAKER_01 2:47

Yeah, I would say trust signals have mattered more than ever, right? So it's always mattered like if off-page SEO, we're talking about backlinks and mentions and features. I would argue now that's more important than ever because realistically, you could show up and Google AI overviews or Gemini or ChatGPT without having a website, right? You could have a YouTube channel, you could have been featured on this podcast, you could have made a LinkedIn post, and you could be featured. So I think that's the big distinction here is that you no longer need a website, although you should have one, in my opinion, but you still can be featured in AI search without a traditional website. So what's more important than ever is showing up on YouTube, right? Going on podcasts, maybe writing a book, maybe speaking at a conference or being featured in the media, like digital PR efforts, I would argue are more important now than ever before. It's building those trust signals, I would say, that really became more important in this AI search era than it was in the just the traditional SEO era.

SPEAKER_00 3:43

Yeah, I agree with you. I've been talking about those third-party citations and citations, but it's really those third-party surfaces for a while now because I noticed that when I'm doing audits for a brand trying to figure out why they're showing up, why they're not showing up, who's showing up instead. A lot of those citations and what pulls in as the sources is not so much the company blog, but everywhere else they show up to. So because you're such a big YouTube guy, I want to ask you a question. Have you noticed how quickly like those videos get pulled into the AI answers? Like, have you been clocking how quick it is?

SPEAKER_01 4:21

Not like to the to the dot, right? But I will tell you, I've never been more bullish on YouTube as a platform, right? Especially as an AI search SEO person. There's a lot of reasons for this. Number one, obviously, Google owns YouTube. So we're starting to see YouTube videos show up, not only more in Google search results, depending on the query, but also AI search results, right? Gemini is taking YouTube transcripts, and it's the Gemini models are being trained a lot from YouTube transcripts, okay? Not to mention, too, YouTube by itself is, I think, the second biggest search engine on the internet behind Google, right? So a lot of people, millions of people, are using YouTube as a search engine. And so that alone needs to be prioritized if you're trying to build on YouTube. You can also use YouTube as your content foundation. I say this all the time. And maybe I'll hop on another podcast episode to explain this, where you can repurpose YouTube videos into SEO optimized blog posts, into short form clips that are SEO optimized for TikTok, Instagram, YouTube Shorts, into email newsletters and other variations of short form content. So again, for all those reasons and more, never been more bullish on YouTube as a platform. And it is becoming more important than ever as we're living in this trust recession, I call it, to show up on long form video to get people to trust you and believe that you're a real person.

SPEAKER_00 5:37

So if I'm listening to this podcast and I'm thinking, okay, I'm gonna get my brand on YouTube now, like this just sold me. What's the first thing that they should be doing?

SPEAKER_01 5:45

They first need to define their ICP, ideal customer profile or target audience. We don't just want to go on YouTube and create random videos that aren't going to reach the people that we want it to reach, right? So if that's step one, is figuring out who your ICP is. Step two is figuring out what are some content ideas that apply to my ICP that my ICP is actually searching for, right? And then after that, it's a matter of maybe doing some keyword research and then optimizing your YouTube videos with good packaging, like title, thumbnail, hook, and other YouTube SEO elements, and then just staying consistent, right? One long form video a week is the bare minimum, in my opinion, that you need to stay consistent on YouTube for the algorithm to continue to reward you.

SPEAKER_00 6:24

So, what's the sweet spot with that YouTube algorithm? Do you think?

SPEAKER_01 6:28

In terms of consistency and publishing, one long form video a week, right? So I say by long form video, I mean a minimum of seven to 10 minutes, I would say. Now there's a lot of nuance to this, depending on your niche, depending on how competitive a certain keyword is on YouTube. But I'm big on long form. I just think long form obviously is easier to get ranked on AI search and Google and YouTube search. And you're gonna attract a better audience or a better ICP, people that are more in that group for you to build trust with them. They're gonna look for things that you're certain that you're ranking for, creating relevant videos, and you're not just pumping out random shorts all over YouTube Shorts, TikTok, and Instagram, although that can be part of the strategy.

SPEAKER_00 7:08

And I think it's important to remember too, like it's not just for YouTube, like these YouTube videos show up everywhere else. I recorded a video on AI Search, like AI, let me try again, AI Share Voice forever ago, and it was just one I recorded at my desk on my phone, and my hair was a hot mess that day. Like it was awful. That video stayed in the AI overview for months until someone came along with a fresher video and then it was replaced. So thinking about that in terms of like video freshness, how do you keep your videos fresh on YouTube without just repeating the same thing over and over?

SPEAKER_01 7:45

Yeah, that's a great question. You know, I always try to look at again who my ICP is and what topics I'm trying to cover. A lot of stuff, I try to make evergreen content. So I think that's the answer we're probably looking for here, right? Now, I understand in the AI space, like I do like five AI marketing tools, the five best AI marketing tools in 2026. Obviously, that you know, topic and that's gonna change on and on and on as more AI tools come in the mix. But what about five best, you know, AI search strategies for 2026? Maybe that's a good evergreen video that lasts for a year until you make a new one for 2027. Or, you know, just think about evergreen style content. Don't go after like the trendy, the news content, because that's gonna be there for a day. And there's a million other videos that are doing the same thing as you are. Try to go for long-form evergreen content that is directed and valuable towards your ICP.

SPEAKER_00 8:36

So we are recording this just for audience awareness. We are recording this on July 30th. It'll probably go out sometime in August. Google just released this month that Search Console with different properties with the YouTube. And I noticed that they have the trending up, trending down. Have you looked at that any?

SPEAKER_01 8:56

No, I just integrated that the other day with was it X and TikTok and Instagram as well? So I'm just letting the data depopulate there, and then I'll take another deep dive.

SPEAKER_00 9:04

Yeah, yeah. I noticed when I did it, it was like, come back in 48 hours. It's like I want it now. Okay, well, I'll save that question for later. But there is something else in your in your intake form that you mentioned, it's exposing the GEO, AEO gurus. I want to give you the floor on that. Just whatever you want to say about that.

SPEAKER_01 9:24

Yeah, it seems like everyone in LinkedIn is very notorious for this. Seems like every time I go on LinkedIn, there's like these GEO, AEO people telling people that SEO is completely dead. Oh my god, I have these secrets for you to rank one on Chat GPT and Claude. Just comment below or get my free guide, right? Well, first of all, these people have no background in the SEO space. And in my opinion, this idea of AI search, it's still a 7525 or 8020 when it comes to traditional SEO fundamentals versus the 20% other things that are different, right? Like an LLMs.txt file, maybe more important schema now with AI search. But the fundamentals still remain consistent. And the reason I say that is that when you search for something on Chat GPT, Claude Perplexity, whatever, one of the first things that they do is retrieval of front page results of Google search and Bing search, right? So if you're not on the front page of Google or Bing, you're already screwed to even start with for most competitive queries that people are searching for. And the reason I say that is because people that completely dismiss SEO and say it's dead, good luck trying to show up in any LLM or AI search result for a competitive query. Sure, you can get away with something that one person searches a month and how convenient. SEO is dead for this one query that you're the only person who searched in the past 60 days. That's the example that they like to show, or these little queries with no search volume, right? But to kind of reiterate on that, Cassie, it's all these people that have no SEO background, that just think they're going to come into the mix, ask AI how to rank an AI search, and then try to fool these people, like these executives that know nothing, they have no time, of just some random AI-generated PDF that they made, or some grifter post where they're trying to get low IQ people in the comments to make their post stand out, right? I don't know. There's just so much grifting and nonsense and the massive education gap in this AI search space. And I think it's just, I don't know, I'm not a big fan of people who try to capitalize on the education gap, is where I was going with that.

SPEAKER_00 11:24

Yeah, and I I agree with you that there's so much misinformation and so little education out there about all of this. Um, I was talking with someone this morning and she said, she said, we have all of this information on how to do great SEO, but for AI search optimization, she's like, it's just not there yet. I'm like, you're correct. That's why we test things. Um so you mentioned though just now when you were talking about this, that lms.txt file. I swear that it's a mouthful when every time I try to say it. When you're advising clients and they come to you and they say, Hey, should we have this file? What are you telling them? And I ask this because if you look at the Google GEO guide, it says no, you don't need it. But if you're thinking about addendic browsing, yeah, maybe you might need it.

SPEAKER_01 12:13

I would say I would rather have it than not. I'm not the person who sits here and like takes Google's advice by the Bible, right? Because a lot of times what's funny about that is Google actually does things on their website that they're telling you not to do, you know, schema being an example. You can study their pages and what things they do is different than what they say you shouldn't do. But yes, I think that you should have an LLMs.txt file or .txt file. But again, it's only gonna be 5% of what actually matters versus the other 95% of mastering the on-page fundamentals and then getting those high quality and relevant trust signals to your brand and your website.

SPEAKER_00 12:49

Is there anything else about trust signals that we're missing in this conversation that you think we should talk about?

SPEAKER_01 12:54

I think being a guest on podcasts is actually becoming more important than ever, right? Obviously, I'm doing it on your podcast selfishly in that regard, but I'm not just saying any podcast, right? I'm talking about podcasts that are relevant to your niche because the more you show up and the more these are published across YouTube, Spotify, Amazon, Apple podcasts, you are telling all these LLMs and Google and Bing that, hey, I'm Ryan Dozer, I'm an AI marketing expert, or hey, I'm Cassie Clark, I run this podcast, right? And the more times that you keep doing this and sending more of these signals to these LLMs and to these algorithms like Google and Bang, your chances, your likelihood and chances of showing up in these citations are going to be higher in your niche.

SPEAKER_00 13:37

I even argued a few weeks ago in my visibility report newsletter that if you want a quick, I put that in quotation marks, everyone, a quick way to start showing up into these AI engines. Start your own podcast because those transcripts get read so much. Have you have you said that to anyone? Start your own podcast, or is it just be a guest?

SPEAKER_01 13:59

I always tell people that that your entire, I get this question all the time from businesses, Cast. Like, I want to create content, but I don't know what to do, right? It doesn't have to be a podcast, although you could do it in this format. Start with the long form content as your foundation. Podcast is a great example of long form content as a foundation. Because, like I said, you can get in all the platforms YouTube, Spotify, Apple. You can use AI and automations to chop it up, remix it, use some skill markdown files and get those published across all other platforms. You can use AI to create short clips and pus those on Instagram, TikTok, etc. And there's just so many other benefits to just having long-form content as that foundation.

SPEAKER_00 14:39

Okay, I'm going to stop it there because I really do want you to come back on a second episode and go really deep into what you're doing with Claude Cowork if you're a Claude Code, if you're okay with sharing that.

SPEAKER_01 14:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:51

Yeah. I mean, that would be that would be great. But there is so much information in there that I think, like, I've had someone on talking about YouTube where he was just testing like AI generated videos for specifically local search, and he said these videos are terrible, but they're actually showing up, they're not showing up so much in the answers, but they were getting their brands recommended because it was about you know therapists or whatever. Um, so it's really nice to have you on to talk about that particular part of it because I'm seeing a lot of my videos that are not I'm not a video person. I'm not a video person yet, but I'm seeing those starting to show up instead of those answers. So I really appreciate you talking about that part.

SPEAKER_01 15:35

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_00 15:36

Yeah. Um yeah, I think I think we're just gonna chop it right there. But I wanted to ask because you mentioned your wife, how is she doing?

SPEAKER_01 15:45

Oh, we got three weeks left till the baby's born.

SPEAKER_00 15:48

I bet she's ready. I bet she's so ready.

SPEAKER_01 15:50

It's about six degrees out here in Des Moines, Iowa lately over the past week. So she's never been more ready than ever.

SPEAKER_00 15:55

Oh, I'd say, I'd say, every are you ready? That's my next question.

SPEAKER_01 15:59

We'll see. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 16:01

Is this your first?

SPEAKER_01 16:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:03

Yeah, yeah, it's exciting. Um, it's scary, but also exciting. I'm gonna stop the recording so I don't keep.